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Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:47 pm
by lucianodato
As a drummer I can speak well of drumgizmo. Programming midi in ardour is not so intuitive at first. But after a bit you will accustom. Sure velocity graphs bars like the ones you get in hydrogen would help a lot in programming dynamics easier but it is doable non the less. Here is a bit of a demo I programmed a while ago
https://instaud.io/1ikH
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:52 pm
by funkmuscle
lucianodato wrote:As a drummer I can speak well of drumgizmo. Programming midi in ardour is not so intuitive at first. But after a bit you will accustom. Sure velocity graphs bars like the ones you get in hydrogen would help a lot in programming dynamics easier but it is doable non the less. Here is a bit of a demo I programmed a while ago
https://instaud.io/1ikH
that's you playing or midi files edited in Ardour? Sounded great.. natural
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:58 pm
by lucianodato
That's all hand written midi
.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:18 pm
by funkmuscle
lucianodato wrote:That's all hand written midi
.
NICE!!!! what kit?
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:23 pm
by lucianodato
DRSkit. You'll be surpised on how little velocity editing is needed. It's more knowing how the drums should be played more than anything.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:28 pm
by funkmuscle
lucianodato wrote:DRSkit. You'll be surpised on how little velocity editing is needed. It's more knowing how the drums should be played more than anything.
Exactly I do very little velocity editing. Maybe a little bit with the hi-hats and maybe a snare drum roll and that's about it.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:04 pm
by lykwydchykyn
I must try this drum gizmo of which you speak.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:57 pm
by funkmuscle
lucianodato wrote:DRSkit. You'll be surpised on how little velocity editing is needed. It's more knowing how the drums should be played more than anything.
DRSkit I love except the kick.. really boxy sounding. I find it hard to get that basketball dribbling on the court sound!
even after EQ cuts at the boxy frequencies, it's still sounds boxy but now I think it's the bleeding of the kick into other mics as the last song I mixed, I was able to get a nice kick sound.
@lucianodato, you said when you have time you'll be doing a kit for DG? I know Glen is busy but can't wait for his kits to be DG ready.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:52 pm
by ivoaudio
lykwydchykyn wrote:- The most basic drumkit miking technique is a close mic on the kick, a close mic on the snare, and two overhead mics covering the cymbals, toms, and snare. (a more complex arrangement would close mic the toms and add room mics). If you can implement individual outputs for your instruments, putting them in this grouping will let you process them more naturally. Also pay attention to the panning in the overheads:
- hihat on the left
- snare middlish left
- crash middlish left
- ride on the right
- Other cymbals middle/right
- toms going from hi->left to low->right
- Use a small/medium room reverb even if you plan to add a longer reverb later. Drums are generally recorded in a fairly live room. I love using convolution reverbs for this application, gives a great sense of realism. Put more reverb on the overheads, since in reality they'd pick up more room sound (but not tons).
I am a drummer myself, and I prefer to pan the other way: from the audience point of view. I play, they listen
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:20 pm
by funkmuscle
I've read before too to add verb to the overheads until I heard a recording of drums (especially the OVH) I loved and the engineer said that he never adds verb to the cymbals.
I tried that and to me, it sounded better too. Yes convolution reverbs to me sound more real too.
That engineers said as usual, they are no rules really, just guidelines and your taste.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:36 pm
by chaocrator
i am a drummer too and have tried every single sampled drumkit ever mentioned on this forum.
nothing even comes close to the sound of my venerable hardware e-drums module (Yamaha DTXPress III).
so, my answer is: used modules like DTXPress III or DTX 2.0 are really cheap nowadays, and MIDI input is there.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:39 pm
by funkmuscle
chaocrator wrote:i am a drummer too and have tried every single sampled drumkit ever mentioned on this forum.
nothing even comes close to the sound of my venerable hardware e-drums module (Yamaha DTXPress III).
so, my answer is: used modules like DTXPress III or DTX 2.0 are really cheap nowadays, and MIDI input is there.
The raw kits from Drumgizmo I thought to my hearing sounded really good especially after sitting there and EQ in them because they are raw. I don't like drum kits where the samples are compressed and acute because it may not fit the song I'm using. Speaking of drummers, you know the guys that drum Gizmo been asking any drummers out there if they can make their own kits available.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 5:34 am
by chaocrator
yes, they are good (otherwise why would anyone need 'em?)
but the sound of hardware module is just better, as for my ear. especially cymbals/hats, and especially if we talk about plain sound without extra processing.
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:46 am
by funkmuscle
chaocrator wrote:yes, they are good (otherwise why would anyone need 'em?)
but the sound of hardware module is just better, as for my ear. especially cymbals/hats, and especially if we talk about plain sound without extra processing.
These modules that you're talking about, do you mean the electronical drum kits?
If yes, I forgot the guy's name but he's on here sometimes, he connected drum Gizmo to I think was an Xbox drum kit and he recorded with it and it actually sounded quite impressive.
Being a guitar player I need to rely on the samples now and with drum Gizmo humanizer and also MusE3 and H2 also has humanizing features so with playing around with that, I have always had people including drummers ask me who is the drummer? I just listen to drummers and copy what I'm hearing kind of like how I learn to play My Guitar. I wish I could sit on a kit and actually play though but I've got two left hands when it comes to that!
Re: Realistic acoustic drums?
Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:39 pm
by CrocoDuck
42low wrote:This raises the suggestion that this third is hit by the drummer slightly different than the other three.
That looks like a nice trick. Maybe you could cook a slightly different sample by processing it with a filter or something else.
Many drum machines have time and intensity "humanizers", that are ways to simulate real human players by varying intensity and timing by random amounts. Hydrogen has the feature, for example. That sounds... interesting. And I went for
a quick search online.
Looks like there are few research on the statistical distribution of timing and intensity of professional drum players, and even their physiology. These two stood up.
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/articl ... =printable
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4934963/
I guess it could be fun to use these to enhance humanization in drum machines.