I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Optimize your system for ultimate performance.

Moderators: khz, MattKingUSA

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:05 pm

So I'm not sure where to post this. Initially this was gonna be a post troubleshooting about LADISH and my midi keyboard. Here's what it was gonna be:
Since a few weeks ago, LADISH has stopped showing my keyboard when I plug it in.

I asked in reddit and the response was that I needed to enable export hardware ports: https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxaudio/com ... d_by_jack/.

This made the keyboard show up, but I don't know how to connect it to anything, since the midi inputs are a different color and won't connect


But on top of that, I also discovered that LADISH just won't launch anymore:

Code: Select all

 > ~ ladi-control-center
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/bin/ladi-control-center", line 28, in <module>
    from laditools import _gettext_domain
  File "/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/laditools/__init__.py", line 25, in <module>
    from .config import LadiConfiguration
  File "/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/laditools/config.py", line 22, in <module>
    from xdg import BaseDirectory as basedir
ImportError: No module named xdg


And even more, for testing I opened ardour and I get, out of nowhere, the following messages: https://paste.xinu.at/HrlU/ https://paste.xinu.at/sPs5o/

so now I literally cannot even listen to the stupid attempts that I've made at learning to record.

It's hard to put into words how discouraging this is. I love music, I love computers, I'm on arch linux and I love fiddling with my system, when something breaks I'm usually able to search around and fix it. But sometimes all I want is to put my fingers on a keyboard and make music.

And every time I try to do that, I feel like the software just shits on my face. I'm tired of it. The worst part is that this didn't come as the result of me trying anything new. Stuff used to be working, now it doesn't.

I really don't know what to do. I love open source. I hate windows, I hate just the thought of using it. But I want to make music. A mac is out of the question, too expensive.

I'll hear any suggestions, I'm not sure if this is a call for help or just getting something off my chest.

User avatar
lilith
Established Member
Posts: 990
Joined: Fri May 27, 2016 11:41 pm
Location: bLACK fOREST
Contact:

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby lilith » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:19 pm

How does your limits.conf looks like? No need to give up. I started without having a clue about linux and it works most of the time. If not I always got help here!

Concerning the Ardour problem you might ask at IRC to get help.

I know sometimes it's discouraging but how discouraging would it be to use Windows :D
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93

_____________________________
Debian 9 (XFCE) & KXStudio repos

User avatar
bhilmers
Established Member
Posts: 155
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:44 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby bhilmers » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:57 pm

yama wrote:But sometimes all I want is to put my fingers on a keyboard and make music....And every time I try to do that, I feel like the software just shits on my face. I'm tired of it. The worst part is that this didn't come as the result of me trying anything new. Stuff used to be working, now it doesn't.

I hear you. I went through this same things a few years ago. My solution was to start using Windows binaries in WINE. I gave Linux audio a few good years, and I really appreciate there is some good tools and active development, but I just got tired of the instability. In fact, I don't even bother with low-latency WINE anymore (since it broke my system a few months ago). The Windows tools I used years ago still work great and do everything I need. On Ubuntu, WINE hooks into Pulse Audio and I never have to think about sound servers or configuration files. "It just works."

I think the big realization for me was that I like monolithic DAWs and don't have need for low latency audio (a little latency is fine). Muse and Ardour are the only projects that fit my workflow. I've had problems running Muse since v2 was released, but I did write a track in Ardour v5 last year and had a great experience. So it's possible in the future I might abandon WINE in favor of doing everything in Ardour, but only if it means I'll have stability and a good out-of-box experience. I don't want to think about my system, I want to think about music.

jonetsu
Established Member
Posts: 1426
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:05 am

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby jonetsu » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:10 pm

yama wrote: And every time I try to do that, I feel like the software just shits on my face. I'm tired of it. The worst part is that this didn't come as the result of me trying anything new. Stuff used to be working, now it doesn't. I really don't know what to do. I love open source. I hate windows, I hate just the thought of using it. But I want to make music. A mac is out of the question, too expensive.


Years ago I had some 'problems' setting up audio and musical tools. I eventually fixed them all. I even checked the latency using an audio cable to/from the sound card and 'installed' a low-latency kernel., Needed to record acoustic guitar with headphones. 'Installed' is a big word since Linux Mint comes with a low latency kernel, just have to click on it to 'install' it. Nothing else to do. Memory stuff in limits.conf, interrupt priority. I've written all that and been using that through system upgrades (Linux Mint).

I use Bitwig to create and Mixbus32C to mix and master. Until earlier this year I was only using native Linux plugins. u-he synths and audio processing, OvertoneDSP, pianoteq, DiscoDSP, Biotek, Loomer, etc... The only Open Source I tried to use was Zynaddsubfx but then the documentation is 90% missing, and did not felt like spending time as an explorer when there were so many great synths around like Diva, Zebra, Baziile, Discovery Pro, etc... Not to mention the free Linux u-he synths. Zynaddsunfx has great potential though. But it's mined by the lack of documentation for such a complex synth. And there's OB-Xd also which is all right: a simple synth that requires no documentation.

Then I decided, after seeing years of people twisting around wine and coming up with elaborate workarounds which I absolutely did not want to do because I wanted to make music, not to fix software, I decided to try what seemed to be the most straightforward approach: linvst. And it works for my purpose. Nothing to fix, nothing to workaround.

I do not hate Windows. I do not love Linux. These are tools. I do not like the Windows operating system. Since I have the choice, I use Linux. Since a long time now. One thing though that can be noticed, when falling into the large pool of commercial audio plugins that the Windows market creates, is that there's serious business to cater to both innovation and the user. A product without documentation is not seen. People are actually working on it, and not only spending weekends and evenings and time here and there. So I'm glad to have gotten some audio plugins that originally are working on Windows to add colors and textures and processing to the original palette.

And since maybe 3-4 years I am not fiddling with the audio system. I power up and make music and/or mix. In 2.5 years I came up with more than 400 hundred sketches with some being developed and posted on soundcloud as you can see in the signature below.

Since you like fiddling with the system when it needs it I would say gather patience and iron out the problems. And take notes. Once you'll get audio working well keep your notes in a safe place. You won't have to go back fixing things endlessly if you do not willingly change modify the OS in some ways. And you'll be able to boot up and create music immediately.

Cheers.

User avatar
milk
Established Member
Posts: 144
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2016 9:08 am
Location: Edinburgh
Contact:

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby milk » Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:43 pm

yama wrote:

Code: Select all

ImportError: No module named xdg


do you have python-xdg installed?

edit: whoopy, ignore that, that's for python3

python2-xdg is for python2

(hmm, neither laditools nor laditools-git has that dependency, but it's possibly such a common module that no-one has noticed so far..?)
they/them (nb/gq/tg, ta)
wiki.thingsandstuff.org/Audio and related pages - a collection of mostly Linux and free links (OpenID auth for anti-spam, try DW)
Linux Digital Audio and Music Workstation Comparison Matrix - collaborative Google Sheet

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Sat Sep 22, 2018 1:58 am

Thanks for responding.

falkTX wrote:ladish has been dead since a few years, so I expect things to slowly not work there anymore.
It is being removed from archlinux, and soon enough from Debian too.

might be that you just need to try out new tools, seeing as the current ones dont work well.


Oh really? See this is something else that kinda discourages me, the amount of tools is overwhelming, and so is knowing what each is for. I might have programs that are redundant but I just have them installed because I see them mentioned a lot.

What would you recommend?

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:04 am

lilith wrote:How does your limits.conf looks like? No need to give up. I started without having a clue about linux and it works most of the time. If not I always got help here!

Concerning the Ardour problem you might ask at IRC to get help.

I know sometimes it's discouraging but how discouraging would it be to use Windows :D


Thanks for the encouragement! Here's my limits.conf: https://paste.xinu.at/3SZ/

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:07 am

bhilmers wrote:
yama wrote:But sometimes all I want is to put my fingers on a keyboard and make music....And every time I try to do that, I feel like the software just shits on my face. I'm tired of it. The worst part is that this didn't come as the result of me trying anything new. Stuff used to be working, now it doesn't.

I hear you. I went through this same things a few years ago. My solution was to start using Windows binaries in WINE. I gave Linux audio a few good years, and I really appreciate there is some good tools and active development, but I just got tired of the instability. In fact, I don't even bother with low-latency WINE anymore (since it broke my system a few months ago). The Windows tools I used years ago still work great and do everything I need. On Ubuntu, WINE hooks into Pulse Audio and I never have to think about sound servers or configuration files. "It just works."

I think the big realization for me was that I like monolithic DAWs and don't have need for low latency audio (a little latency is fine). Muse and Ardour are the only projects that fit my workflow. I've had problems running Muse since v2 was released, but I did write a track in Ardour v5 last year and had a great experience. So it's possible in the future I might abandon WINE in favor of doing everything in Ardour, but only if it means I'll have stability and a good out-of-box experience. I don't want to think about my system, I want to think about music.


This appeals to me, but I never tried that path, I just assumed it was too complicated. Could you guide me on where to find tutorials and whatnot?

I don't know if I could deal with high latency, since I often just want to play the keyboard for playing sake, but I'd like to give this a try.

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:12 am

jonetsu wrote:
yama wrote: And every time I try to do that, I feel like the software just shits on my face. I'm tired of it. The worst part is that this didn't come as the result of me trying anything new. Stuff used to be working, now it doesn't. I really don't know what to do. I love open source. I hate windows, I hate just the thought of using it. But I want to make music. A mac is out of the question, too expensive.


Years ago I had some 'problems' setting up audio and musical tools. I eventually fixed them all. I even checked the latency using an audio cable to/from the sound card and 'installed' a low-latency kernel., Needed to record acoustic guitar with headphones. 'Installed' is a big word since Linux Mint comes with a low latency kernel, just have to click on it to 'install' it. Nothing else to do. Memory stuff in limits.conf, interrupt priority. I've written all that and been using that through system upgrades (Linux Mint).

I use Bitwig to create and Mixbus32C to mix and master. Until earlier this year I was only using native Linux plugins. u-he synths and audio processing, OvertoneDSP, pianoteq, DiscoDSP, Biotek, Loomer, etc... The only Open Source I tried to use was Zynaddsubfx but then the documentation is 90% missing, and did not felt like spending time as an explorer when there were so many great synths around like Diva, Zebra, Baziile, Discovery Pro, etc... Not to mention the free Linux u-he synths. Zynaddsunfx has great potential though. But it's mined by the lack of documentation for such a complex synth. And there's OB-Xd also which is all right: a simple synth that requires no documentation.

Then I decided, after seeing years of people twisting around wine and coming up with elaborate workarounds which I absolutely did not want to do because I wanted to make music, not to fix software, I decided to try what seemed to be the most straightforward approach: linvst. And it works for my purpose. Nothing to fix, nothing to workaround.

I do not hate Windows. I do not love Linux. These are tools. I do not like the Windows operating system. Since I have the choice, I use Linux. Since a long time now. One thing though that can be noticed, when falling into the large pool of commercial audio plugins that the Windows market creates, is that there's serious business to cater to both innovation and the user. A product without documentation is not seen. People are actually working on it, and not only spending weekends and evenings and time here and there. So I'm glad to have gotten some audio plugins that originally are working on Windows to add colors and textures and processing to the original palette.

And since maybe 3-4 years I am not fiddling with the audio system. I power up and make music and/or mix. In 2.5 years I came up with more than 400 hundred sketches with some being developed and posted on soundcloud as you can see in the signature below.

Since you like fiddling with the system when it needs it I would say gather patience and iron out the problems. And take notes. Once you'll get audio working well keep your notes in a safe place. You won't have to go back fixing things endlessly if you do not willingly change modify the OS in some ways. And you'll be able to boot up and create music immediately.

Cheers.


Bitwig seems right up my alley from the demo, unfortunately I can't afford it.

I hope I can achieve a setup like you describe, but I barely know what 90% of the programs you mentioned do. I don't know why I feel more reluctant to learn and troubleshoot audio programs than I do "regular" programs. And I do take notes! I have that habit for everything.

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Sat Sep 22, 2018 1:14 pm

milk wrote:
yama wrote:

Code: Select all

ImportError: No module named xdg


do you have python-xdg installed?

edit: whoopy, ignore that, that's for python3

python2-xdg is for python2

(hmm, neither laditools nor laditools-git has that dependency, but it's possibly such a common module that no-one has noticed so far..?)


Okay now it's stopped giving me the error, but the ladish window won't appear.

User avatar
lilith
Established Member
Posts: 990
Joined: Fri May 27, 2016 11:41 pm
Location: bLACK fOREST
Contact:

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby lilith » Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:04 am

Your limits.conf is basically empty as every line is commented. You should include the two important lines as described here:

https://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system ... faudioconf

What distro are you running? You might also read:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=18436
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93

_____________________________
Debian 9 (XFCE) & KXStudio repos

Baggypants
Established Member
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 11:28 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby Baggypants » Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:00 am

lilith wrote:Your limits.conf is basically empty as every line is commented. You should include the two important lines as described here:

https://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system ... faudioconf

What distro are you running? You might also read:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=18436


It might be in a file under /etc/security/limits.conf.d/

User avatar
CrocoDuck
Established Member
Posts: 1049
Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 6:12 pm
Contact:

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby CrocoDuck » Sat Sep 29, 2018 12:16 pm

Yeah, Ladish is not under development anymore, seems like, so probably it is slowly fading away. I am not sure if there are equivalent programs which are under active development.
Check my Linux audio experiments on my SoundCloud.
Browse my AUR packages.
Fancying a swim in the pond?

User avatar
khz
Established Member
Posts: 1134
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2008 6:29 am
Location: German

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby khz » Sat Sep 29, 2018 1:02 pm

CrocoDuck wrote:I am not sure if there are equivalent programs which are under active development.

About 10 programs, whether active development no idea, rather do not think. https://wiki.linuxaudio.org/apps/categories/ladish_l1
ladish-1.tar.bz2 19-Dec-2011 17:30 599209 https://wiki.linuxaudio.org/apps/all/ladish >> http://ladish.org/download/
FZ - Does humor belongs in Music?
GNU/LINUX@AUDIO ~ /Wiki $ Howto.Info && GNU/Linux Debian installing >> Linux Audio Workstation LAW
    I don't care about the freedom of speech because I have nothing to say.

yama
Established Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: I feel like giving up with audio as a whole

Postby yama » Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:00 am

Baggypants wrote:
lilith wrote:Your limits.conf is basically empty as every line is commented. You should include the two important lines as described here:

https://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system ... faudioconf

What distro are you running? You might also read:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=18436


It might be in a file under /etc/security/limits.conf.d/


You're right. I recently reinstalled arch and just checked this directory and there's a file 99-realtime-privileges.conf.


Return to “System Tuning and Configuration”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests